Thailand is one of the most popular holiday destinations in the world. Foreingers are welcome to visit the 'land of smiles' during their vacation.
Yet there seems to be a deeply rooted distrust and dislike of the foreiners and their culture, value system etc. This has been highlighted by a recent wave of crimes against foreign nationals reported in the international media. New visa regulations have been tightened by the 'Thai rak Thai' (Thais love Thai) party, foreigners are still barred from landownersip and even owning a car is made impossible by some local offices.
Evening entertainment areas are being zoned and early closing times imposed to protect Thailand's youth from 'immoral influences'.
Yet Royalty and the upper classes pride themselves of education in leading Universities in the States or Europe.

Is this a case of unfounded xenophobia, another example of the nationalism in S.E.asia or simply common sense?

It works both ways stroll, how about the common reference to "bar girl" or "non bar girl" in thaivisa when referring to Thai ladies? That suggests that thai ladies are bar girl first and that the everyday ladies are the exception. This is a foreigners perception of Thailand, not an accurate one from my experience.

Sure, living in Thailand my perception is not an 'objective' one. And maybe my post is a bit provocative to get the ball rolling?

- This is a diatribe of idiocy proclaimed in ignorance and pontificated by an unknowing troll who would and has said this unfounded and without merit statement.
-
- I have been visiting Thailand for 26 years living there as much as 6 months every year.
-
- The Thai people are no more mistrustful or violent than anyone else of foreigners.
-
- This person insults not only the intelligence of any reader on these forums but equally lacks any real knowledge of Thai people.
-
- He is a troll, a mere pretender of identity and knowledge, mindless in thought and unrepentantly a fraud in thoughtful intent.

That is all!

Care to comment on the subject? Why not put the record straight?

It worked then

However I too feel strongly about the uninformed perception of people and cultures, it is so hard to break out of the mould we were all born into.
However persistance and an open mind will eventually help to break down any barriers and make life so much more enjoyable even in a place one detests.

This has been my experience anyhow, and where I am working right now I need to keep visiting my above statement each day to remain on top of my emotions and keep a positive outlook.

Comparing your 24 postings (mostly copy-paste text about elections in the USA and such stuff) and the over 400 postings of STROLL, I ask myself, who is here the unknown troll.



Your signature text speaks for itself. Miss Manners might recommend you to correct it.


It depends from which country you are from.....I am living since almost 30 years in Japan, and I cannot confirm your observation.

You are obviously from USA. I heard it is pretty safe there if you move around in a group, carrying your own firearms....

Comparing however Thailand with USA does not mean, to compare Thailand with the world.

Why not to spend your holidays in a peaceful SouthThai Fishermen Muslim village?
Really nice, and nothing to worry about, Thai police and Thai Army will protect your life.

And yes, Stroll is right, foreigners cannot own land in Thailand, but Thai citizens might buy land in the USA.

Johann

To stereotype myself as the commentator here has and or to otherwise erroneously stereotype the relationship of Thai’s and Farangs as this person earlier so fraudulently implied and expressed stands unrequited and as such needed and or needs rebuttal.

I, and I see others, who may be knowledgeable on the subject, gave that earlier statement a clear and concise rebuttal as to its veracity and correctness. So there is nothing else to say on that subject.

As to other’s who would comment on me, the USA and Thailand.

My response is simply bolder dash! Someone here obviously knows less about the USA than they do about Thailand.

I loved the ”traveling in-group” “firearm” stereotype of us Yanks. It’s classic anti-American diatribe that is so off base as to who we are as a people and a nation.

If you know anything about Thailand you will know what 5555 means as would be fitting as to my response to both issue.

To be politically correct while ever so politely putting it up your condescending, misinformed and biased ### as they say. I would rebut as to the following:

To wit;

In my family in Thailand. We have persons of Thai, Yank, Brit, Chinese and Indian (India) nationalities. We share bread, love, money and live among each other participating respectfully and joyfully in each other’s cultures, customs and religious activities. We don’t judge nor are we judged by one another. We accept each as to who they are and for what they are.

Likewise, my family is made up of various religions including Christians inclusive of Mormons, Buddhist, and Muslims. On top of that, my extended family in Thailand and the USA has numerous races including Anglos (whites), Blacks, Hispanics and Asians as those among various types of relatives and in laws.

Is that eclectic enough of a yank stereotype for you!

Yes, I said it Muslims. Now according to your thought speak these are the dreaded enemies of us Yanks. Is that not the stereotypical leftist Anti-Yank BS you aspire to believe. Aspirations which, as we all know, some ill informed people express stereotypically as fact about those they know not of and about whom they are most usually wrong.

I have a wonderful Thai/Chinese sister-in law, a Thai/Indian brother-in-law and three-drop dead gorgeous nieces all of whom are Muslims. We have and will continue to have, beyond this ignorance of stereotyping, a loving and carrying relationship.

Smoke that in prejudicial pooper scupper my condescending amigo!

Similarly, If 2 to 10 word posts of mostly emptiness are quantitatively meaningful to you in terms of who may or may not be a troll then have at it. Birds of a feather as they say!

I do not need anyone’s verification of who or what I am. I am most proud of myself, my Family, their ethnicity and their varying cultures and customs. Thank you very much!

That is all!

Reaching further into the realms of truth
than destroying prejudices and stereotypes against a most exquisite and eloquent multicultural citizen of the world such as yourself,
upholding truth and dignity in the face of illintended, ignorant trolls,

may I humbly ask you, sire, to elaborate further your most valuable insights and revelations concerning the much illconceived relationship between the noble Thai of all persuasions and the wretched Farang, as well as his more educated and wisened brothers;
beyond your immediate family relations of immeasurable harmony and tolerance, which is no doubt representative of all but the most depraved pretenders of identity and knowledge?

555
To be satisfied with a little, is the greatest wisdom; and he that increaseth his riches, increaseth his cares; but a contented mind is a hidden treasure, and trouble findeth it not. - Akhenaton



The young man knows the rules, but the old man knows the exceptions. -
Oliver Wendell Holmes



The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing. - Socrates


That is all!

Strolls statement makes sense to me, Thailand, if it likes to play a major role in South East Asia in the future, it will have to open up its country more to the foreign market. Restrictions for foreigners, who are willing to work together with Thai people cannot be a good-working long-term solution.

Comments like those of Ustrader, are ridiculous in content and are non-productive for a wider co-operation between Thailand and developed countries. High living standards through income of foreign currency cannot be earned by imposing restrictions. Stroll mentioned correctly problems like confusing visa-regulations and foreign landownership.

Considering the economic situation of that region, Thailand has to hurry up and to decide, what its government really wants to do….restricting foreign influence and to accept lower living standards, or to open up and to co-operate with developed countries.

Ustrader is totally unaware of the gloomy outlook of Thailand’s future.
Instead of showing up as the deeply insulted Thai/Indian/Chinese family-culture-centered educational consultant, he better should explain, what he recommends to keep Thailand’s economy competitive against its Asian neighbours.

Tukyleith - please - look at the Thaivisa-Forum....
they have a hard time to lock all threads regarding to bargirls and non-bargirls....
They just closed down over 15 threads .....

They even had a bargirl-thread about 'Do you like bargirl-threads?'

Bargirls unhappy, bargirls as mia noi, bargirls with smelling towels, bargirls for marriage, and how do you know she is a bargirl, if she tells you, she is a non-bar-girl...and so on.....and so on.....

To answer your question,

...that thai ladies are bar girl first and that the everyday ladies are the exception.

Please read the Thaivisa-Forum thread, especially the last posting!
Do Thai Women Enjoy A Vibrator ?, (BGs or non BGs )
http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=17629

Wolfie - Thu 2004-09-30, 17:06:53
Thread locked.
The Admin/Moderator team do not want such posts made on ThaiVisa.com.
Please take this kind of content elsewhere... not here.

Please do not mention anything about bargirls anymore, or they will move all such postings into the Bearpit!

Must agree Yohan, it is degenerating over there rapidly. Even your old nemisis,
Tutsi Warrior has stood up to protest against the rubbish that is collecting by the minute there. Anyway, see you around.
Nitwit.

To bring it back on topic, I think this preoccupation with 'bargirls' which a section of the visitors to Thailand display, feeds the efforts of the Thai rak Thai party to clean up the image of their country, be more selective in whom to welcome in and tighten visa regulations.

That would be very hypocritic as only about 5 % of the whole scene caters to farangs. Then again it is also the most visible part on Suhkumvit ghetto.

Mike

I think, you are mentioning an important point.
- Clean up the image of the country -
And also Mike said something which is very true......
only 5 %? What is with the other 95 %?

The answer is easy, all this is simply political propaganda, to promise this and that to Thai people to gain more votes.....

For example, how can they promise they will manage the Government like in Singapore? Singapore has no acriculture, and therefore no problem with that at all. Now can you imagine, to manage Thailand without considering anything about acriculture.....

To promise higher living standards.....Thailand has now already its problems, because USD2000,- per capita/year is internationally low, but it is high, compared to Vietnam or China.
If they make too much problems to the foreign business, like unreasonable taxes or salary demands, factories or other businesses, which have strong foreign influence (and there are a lot of them) will just reduce their activity and move to somewhere else, and they will dismiss the Thai staff.
How can Thailand really earn money with restrictions, but nothing else in return?

OK, make troubles to the foreign tourists, all what is cheap - out with them. -
The high-class tourist, they like so much, will stay some days with prebooked arrangements in a foreign owned hotel-chain - but next year, because money is not so important for them, they will visit another country....for sure they will not visit Thailand every year.
How can you expect Thailands foreign tourists will increase from 10 million to 20 million visitors? What do you offer them?

What is the next? High inflation? Devaluation?

I wonder, if such strange promises help to open Thailand more to foreigners....
I think, Thailand has not much choice....

Either foreigners into the country and enjoy better life or cut down on them, which means, lowering considerable the living standard, and be a proud, but poor Thai...independent from foreigners...Up to them to decide their future!

I have almost never visited thiavisa.com, but Yohan's link to the vibrator thread I found hilarious. I have cut and pasted several of my favorites together and here they are, and for the complete thread follow his link:

Any readers tried a vibrator on their takeouts ?
what were the results ? good or no .
stipulate if using a slim wand or full blown rubber copy of a member

Yes i would imagine they do like it, i always thought that a tongue is better though

decent well brought up tg's do not generally go in for foreplay in the same way as farang girls for example... foreplay in this context means pleasuring of the sexual organs with anything other than a penis or tongue

Why would i want to do that to my (takeouts) Sweet & Sour Chicken?

I just tried....
It made a mess. Rice all over the table. And floor. My teeth tickled too.

You actually put a vibrator in your mouth???

I tried it too. Chipped me bloody teeth.

Hahaha........Come on man, you should know not to use your teeth. Just suck.
That's what I tell da bayitches....

When I came back from the UK last week, I brought back a 'buzzing banana' for my Mia Noi (Honest, it was for medical purposes only...)
Her eyes almost popped out of her head when she saw it!! Did she like it?? YES!!

Expatriot life-Thiavisa Forum (49 pages)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What does it take to bag a "normal" girl?

Too much time. Too much uncertainty. lies? getting to know the person. Letting the other find out your faults. getting "trained" - whipped. blah blah blah and then the breakup.

or get married then divorce, then give all your money away.

or.

Have a beer, look around, find one you like, get a nice smile, good laugh and probly shagadelic night. In the morning, wish her well, smile and send her off

hmmmm. Pretty easy choice really.

I should have known the consequences of opening a 'Thailand' topic. I was hoping more of the folks who live there would comment. I should have considered my opening more carefully. Yohan made some valuable points, Thailand being the strongest economy amongst its neighbours, it wants to further this through economic partnerships and by providing a stable and welcoming environment for overseas investors. Thailand (translated land of the free) is the only nation in the region which had not been colonialised, hence a national pride which is different from that of formerly occupied states.


I am glad you have some valuable memories from dipping over to Thai-visa, Niagara. But let me assure you what you quoted only represents a small portion of what is posted there, in fact this thread has been closed. Also, it contains a fair amount of 'intalk', out of context, in the same way as some other quotes from different forums that have been brought here not long ago. But you might appreciate now that some Thais have a rather low opinion of foreigners. The few who leave a bad impression are very noticable in Bangkok and a few other areas. ( I am not saying I've never been to a massage parlour)

This is one of those threads that belongs back in TV. Whenever someone brings up overt political items there, the thread is closed down with the recommendation to take it to the Bear Pit.
As been said, the old BG theme has been discussed ad nasuem over there for a long time without any "resolution".
And, speaking of BG's, it's been the way it is since before Vietnam days. Only came to the forefront, so to speak when GI's were down in Pattaya on R&R.

I have never been to SE Asia, only North and Central America, and Europe. I of course have talked to Viet Nam vets, and I have two cousins who married Viet Namese women. The added dimension of the Bearpit is the connection to SE Asia through the Thiavisa forum. I found the Bearpit by accident. I tried to look at the Thiavisa, but I had a hard time navagating it and gave up. This thread was only an accidental pointer to the meaty parts of Thiavisa. I saw Georgie's avitar used by someone else, and stoll, I saw you were looking at that forum last night, and your avitar is different also.

Believe me, there was nothing I quoted which was out of context, and I referred back to the thread through Yohan's link. I think opinions are two sided also. Thais have opinions of foreigners, and "foreigners" have opinions of Thais. One does not carry any greater weight than the other.

ft. niagara~

As everyone here who has lived, or currently lives or visited Thailand would say - it's highly recommended as a destination for a holiday or permament residence.
No offense taken re. the point of your thread it's just that the old bar girl-bashing theme has been so beat into the ground - that's why you got the response you did.

One final comment that does apply is that Thailand is like dying and going to heaven...

Reminds me of the story of the priest who had a heartattack while.....Oh, never mind, this doesn't belong here.

Sorry, Niagara, I wasn't accusing you of anything, just saying that there is more to TV than the 'vibrator' topic.

Let us talk about the financial and economic position of Thailand today.

The best for sure is to forget about the bar-girl threads, while in the bearpit.
Considering Thailand as a whole, bargirl-connections can be seen as a fall-out or by-product....

However it is a valid question to ask, why Thailand got this image......

While Thai people, who are very often of course not related to that bar-girl-scenario at all, are questioning themselves why foreigners think about them like that, the angry and hateful way of some Thai people to accuse only the foreigner is not a good and not a true argument to improve relationship.

I think, the truth is somewhere in the middle.... Thailand would be a very poor nation without openminded leadership towards Western countries... and there is no doubt, that Thailand benefits of contacts with foreigners, earning a considerable amount of foreign currency.

As far the question is about criminal-tourism into Thailand, Thailand cannot keep only the foreigners responsible. It is a 50/50 position, and whereever foreigners are dealing with drugs, Thai criminals are co-operating with them, when foreigners are looking for sex with minors, Thai criminals are co-operating with them, when foreigners are looking for new names, passports and visa, Thai criminals are co-operating with foreigners -

About sex-tourism (which cannot be considered as a criminal offence) - foreigners are welcome to spend money by some local Thai hotel managements, restaurants and bars, it benefits all sectors of transportation from airlines to taxi, shops and of course also some local and foreign boys and girls........they ALL make a profit out of it. Sex-tourism is a business, too and Thailand made the mistake to commercialize it. To get ride off this bad image now after so many years is not easy.

Where to begin?

I think, Thai people should be aware more about their own government and their business regulations.

International Corruption Perceptions Index: best=10, worst =0
Thailand=3.2

This makes Thailand equal to Panama, Usbekistan, Malawi, Senegal, Turkey and Egypt, when doing international business.

The World Bank (Development Indicators) fixed Thailand on position No. 104 (out of 208 positions) - in financial and economic terms Thailand is seen equally to
Peru, El Salvator, Iran and Romania.

Comment out of the Corruption Perceptions Index 2002 Report
"Political elites and their cronies continue to take kickbacks at every opportunity. Hand in glove with corrupt business people, they are trapping whole nations in poverty and hampering sustainable development. Corruption is perceived to be dangerously high in poor parts of the world, but also in many countries whose firms invest in developing nations,"

"Politicians increasingly pay lip-service to the fight against corruption but they fail to act on the clear message, that they must clamp down on corruption to break the vicious circle of poverty and graft. Seven out of ten countries score less than 5 out of a clean score of 10 in 2002, which reflects perceived levels of corruption among politicians and public officials."

"Corrupt political elites in the developing world, working hand-in-hand with greedy business people and unscrupulous investors, are putting private gain before the welfare of citizens and the economic development of their countries. From illegal logging to blood diamonds, we are seeing the plundering of the earth and its people in an unsustainable way."



Let us try, to keep this THAILAND thread in the bearpit - I think, we can shift it to talk about politics and economics.

This is a usual post from you = it means nothing!

Living in Thailand and visiting Thailand is not the same.

I think your right to a certain extent Stroll.

They are a truly patriotic nation and do not like outsiders cultures infringing on their own. Many of their rules for foreigners are the same as many countries.
I still feel welcome here and I wouldnt say it is a "wave of crimes against foreigners", as it is only a few cases compared to the national stats.

I hope Thailand trys harder to keep control of their culture as I see a huge influx of western ideas ruining it in the short term.
As I live here longer, I to distrust the foreigners coming in and move to get away from them.

Am I Thai - no never, but I am definatley no foreigner either as this feels normal to me.

I hear that Wal Mart is planning a SuperCenter for Phuket. Give those Carrefur folks a little competition!

Again, you heard wrong. Who told you that - Bush?

These two positions are listed in my Kama Sutra.

Sorry for the typo.
These two positions are NOT listed in my Kama Sutra.

Wait! Maybe it was a Kentucky Fried! Anyhow, what's a little wrong with a little greasy fried chicken to go with that som tam!

Well maybe Bush had something to do with 9/11

BTW people, Boon Mee is a part time visitor to Thailand, does not live here and knows nothing about living here

I was waiting for this one outa you, Gent.
I have probably lived in Thailand more time than you and have a much greater understand of the place than you'll have in 10 lifetimes.
How long have you been married to your Thai wife?

Having a Thai wife or an Eskimo wife does not mean you understand the country they come from, unless you live there.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?sh...=0&#entry181394

Folks...we got a genuine Thailand expert here on this Forum. He lives in the heart of Farangland - Phuket. Been there maybe 5 or 6 years and KNOWS it all!
Bet he can't spell his own name in Thai though...

Most Americans understand shite about their own country, why would anyone parade on a webboard and claim to understand anything about Thailand ?
I have come and gone to LOS since 24 years, married a Thai, and still learn everyday, only fools will never admit never to learn anything new.

BTW, how do you measure knowledge on LOS against each other ???

Mike

I bet he can!

I am not an expert, I am a guy who has lived in Thailand for 7 years and know what I know. Thailand has changed in the last 7 years and a holiday maker only sees the Thailand that is needed to be seen. Doing business here as opposed to going up north to the wifes village and being the king for a week, is not what Thailand is.

Boon Mee, I have been all over Thailand and chose to work in Phuket as it was starting to boom - nice move BTW.

I am pretty fluant in Thai both Southern dialect and "Bangkok Thai". I even can hold my own in Isaan dialect. I also have a company with 150 staff who come from all over. I have a Thai wife. I own cars/toys and houses. I am also a member of the Phuket rotary club. I am here, you are not - so what is your point?

I live and breathe Thailand 24hours a day, I do business with all types and converse in their language as well. Expert - no! but a ###### good handle on how it all works.

Tamai, Khun hie phen hah wanee? Me boot huer mai? bi kin yah para de qua.

It's not possible...it's just the Gent stirring up shite again. Bragging on how he's an expert after living in LOS after 5 or 6 years...

please read above post!

You have been wrong all day, might be time to lay down.

"Tamai, Khun hie phen hah wanee? Me boot huer mai? bi kin yah para de qua."

What is that??? Portuguese? Para de qua looks a little off to be Thai there, buddy.

พมเป๊นคนบ้านนอก but I do comprende!

you say you speak Thai, but you dont understand. My phonetics might not be great but my language is. Para is the Thai abbreviation to paracetimol.

The rest you will have to dig deep into your language skills and try and come up with a better excuse for not understanding.

BTW - You writing is pretty good

The pissing contest is what it is - Boon Mee trying to tell us how Thailand is whilst being in the USA - you truly are a Bushite and the republicans should be proud of you.

All that, and still plenty of time to paste the whole Bear-Pit and thaivisa.com with wacky posts 24 hours a day - very impressive!

Very restrained post Georgie, I'm proud!

You noticed!

ในฐานะคนนอกความเห็นของคุณเกี่ยวกับamericaเหลวแหลก

As best as I can figure the first part of Ignoy statement is Why Mr are you pointing?

I took the rest to 3 native speakers and they have not a qlue?

แก้ไขผลลัพธ์
maybe?

150 employee's in Phucket, no longer retired I guess. Inn Keeper I surmise.

Your good friends with Patong Beach's Khun Upatising are you?

South Thai Farang - Phucket is not Southern Thailand. Drive on down to the real southern Thailand and stay for a month or two at Sadao, Yala or better yet Satun and try your dilects on them folks to get a feel for the world outside Farangville..

On the other hand as I have a deep abiding respect for Aussy from my Vietnam days, assuming that is true, I would not advice it. Though I am sure a real digger can take care of himself.

Also visit Nan or Mae Sai you know the other way. Stay for about a month or so to really get the local feel.

Peace and love!


That is all

######ing septics!

Yep...we catch you out everytime, Gent!

I dont know what you think you caught me out on, but anyway Ill let you guys dribble on some more until the thread is closed.

Boon keep on drilling mate and I hope you get to live here one day.

I noticed you didn't respond to knowing Patong Beach's Khun Upatising?

you should you know. I believe he knows you.

Well, for one thing, we know you can't speak Thai!