http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/columns/pre...t_id=1000920906


Bush Sold the War on WMDs, Not Regime Change
With embarassing new revelations on WMDs emerging, and Bush poll numbers slipping, the president's supporters in the press argue that he actually sold the war to the public on the basis of freedom for the Iraqis, not on a WMD threat to Americans. A look at Bush's final messages to the public and to Congress just before the war began prove otherwise.

By Greg Mitchell

Bush sold the war on the basis WMDs, which were not found in Iraq.

Um, doesn't EVERYBODY here know that? Why are you still making threads about it, everbody knows, and nobody is disputing you.

In other words, Bush lied and thousands died, and all that is seen by you banana Republicans as nothing compared to the deadly crimes and the national security threats created by Slick Willie and Maid Monica. So Bush the liar-in-chief, the empty warhead, will not be impeached. How ironic.

Thank you Roadster.

Ben-T: "Yes, Bush was wrong about WMDs."
Roadster: "AH HA! See Bush lied!"

I honestly doubt you can see the difference between what Ben-T said and the words you put in his mouth. Have some kool-aid.


OHHH YEAAAH!

He seemed pretty clear in his meaning. "Saddam Hussein and his sons must leave Iraq within 48 hours. Their refusal to do so will result in military conflict, "

Not get rid of your WMD in 48 hours but instead "LEAVE"!! Sounds like a regime change to me. MARK

Okay some points, just thought I might clear up your ignorance. First off let's start with a simple lesson.

ASSUME makes an ##### out of U and ME

A.) I had lots of mixed feelings on Bill Clinton but I could not have cared less about the Monica scandal and over all I liked him.

B.) I was not of the opinion that any substantial WMDs were going to be found in Iraq.

C.) There was a strong case that they would be found, and there is a very poor case that Bush knowingly lied.

D.) US actions in Iraq serve American interests in a multitude of ways that I can think of off the top of my head, none of them being the prevention of WMD proliferation. I supported and continue to support the US war in Iraq for these reasons.

British Lawmaker Blasts "Republican Lynch Mob":

"Senator, in everything I said about Iraq, I turned out to be right and you turned out to be wrong and 100,000 people paid with their lives, 1600 of them American soldiers sent to their deaths by a pack of lies; 15,000 of them wounded, many of them disabled forever by a pack of lies."

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0517-11.htm

George W. Bush is an ignorant, arrogant, lying demagog, He is a lowlife, greedy, manipulative, repressive, regressive, self serving Texas white-trash scum. May he rot in eternal h#ll for the misery and destruction he has caused. I say God ###### George W. Bush.

Say it again, I don't think I heard you? Roadtwister!

Yet another clairvoyant and idiolect savant dissertation on your President for the next 3 years 8 months and 12 days, I suppose.

You know they have counselors for that level of angered psychosis my Friend, you should seek professional help. It could lead to hopeless dispair and much worst.

To be that angry over politics is very foolish and mentally diminutive. I Hope you don’t have high blood pressure as well.

That is all!

I shouldn't be angry that our government is one incompetent disaster after another and has become a sellout to special interests? Get real.

Oh - I could call or write to my Congressman but you and I know it's waste of time because we don't have anything to contribute to their re-election fund, our opinions count for nothing because we are not some high priced lobbyist.

Fortunately and remarkably, none of that has given me high blood pressure. I will only admit to being unusually gifted in the art of verbal destruction.

I shouldn't be angry that our government is one incompetent disaster after another and in our memory, aways has been a sellout to special interests? Get real.

Oh - I could call or write to my Congressman but you and I know it is, and alway has been a waste of time because we don't have anything to contribute to their re-election fund, our opinions count for nothing because we are not some high priced lobbyist.

Why is it just this government where these things bother you? If it's the war, and nobody really likes war... well as wars go this one ain't so bad. The Kennedy war was pretty bad. Almost had a reeeaaal bad one with him.

First I would like to comment on right wing Benny's notion that "democracy" is “delivered” by military force.... This is absolutely the most ridiculous extreme and dangerous ideological falsehood that exists today! This is something that Hitler and the "dark lord of the sith" would recommend!!

Democracy was delivered to Afghanistan and Iraq via the Ballot Box. Just as it is delivered to any nation. MARK

No, US puppet clowns were delivered, especially Karzai, that guy is obvious (since he worked for US oil company UNICOL... the company doing the oil pipelines for the USA in the region)

Os. My signature is a joke. Do you know how jokes work?


You would find, if you bothered to listen to anything that I say, that I am anything BUT altruistic when it comes to Middle East policy. I am interested in serving United States interests in the region. That is my first and foremost goal. Currently a democratic Iraq serves those interests. The United States and the people of the Arab world have found a common enemy now in the Arab Governments. Your side is about to be consigned to the ashbin of history.

IMPORTANT NOTE: When the Arab people vote in a guy OsManli doesn't like, it's a conspiracy.

When Muslim Dictators like the Mullahs, whom Os seems to love, murder and repress there own people for decades, they are saints. Why are they saints? Because the US doesn't like them, and Os is little more than an Anti-American Anti-Israeli reactionary.

In short Os:

I did like the verbal destruction part. 555

I would nevertheless suggest the party that is far from bona fide reality is yourself, my good sir, as when and where, pray tell, on this planet ,has there been or exists today any government, remotely and vainly different, in some mannerism of act, deed and intent where the powerful and elite are not catered too, my angry friend!

If you seek perfection that does not mimic in one way or another, what you have described herein, it may exist ,but not in this planetary system.

I see, in your search for that holly grail of governmental competence and perfection at the level you would surmise is required, A deep space voyage in your future, as that is a likely place where your dreamlike quest for a holly grail of selfless governments may possible exist I assure you.

In lieu of that space voyage, if impractical , I would suggest an uncharted deserted island, where you can create a government of one that you can create that does not possess the quality that so anger you.

Otherwise, except what is everywhere and is something that changes little form from one generation, centrury or millinum, no matter where, but ever so slightly in almost unnoticeable ways.

That is all!

Osmanli ben Laden uncovered

where is your millenium Flacon my fantasy prognastic?

That is all!

Just about anyone in the region who has worked for any oil production facility has worked for a western based company. Many other businesses in the region are western based as well. So, are you saying that a large percentage of the working public in the region are puppets becasue the get a job, and even more so if it is a really good job?

The wingnuts know that we are stuck in Iraq, no one has the guts to call for a pull out now or in the future.

No one has the guts? Not really. A permanent military ground force has always been the plan. check out http://www.newamericancentury.org


Simply put, though, we don't want to pull out because we really like the big stick that a permanent ground force provides for political negotiations.

The fact that a lot of the policy makers have ties to defense contractors, well ....

Most people here - especially the actual neocons - don't give a rats ##### if they found WMD in Iraq. Ben-T says he didn't expect any to begin with. Its the big stick that matters.

Of course, some people are still hold the notion that we are promoting Freedom and Democracy. Or, at very least, Freedom and Democracy are always in our, and all humans, interests - even if we have to use the military to do it.

But, like Ben-T said in another thread, thats pretty "fluffy duffy" and doesn't actually hold with real policy. We don't care about freedom and democracy except insofar as they make good propaganda. We want a military force there. The military is what enforces our interests.

????? I would say with the facts on the ground ("real policy")in Afghanistan and Iraq, both well on their way to complete, democratic rule, shows you and Ben dont have the slightest idea what you are talking about. MARK

Dixon don't be silly.

The United States will deliver Democracies to Arab nations if and when delivering democracies to said arab interests serves the interests of the United States of America. There is nothing morally wrong with this. If the US was in the Middle East simply running around to spread love, freedom, and charity, I would be opposed to it. The United States Government has a responsiblity to protect the interests of the United States of America, and that is what it is doing.

Pisse Off American, you are being equally silly.

Operation Matador is ravaging Insurgent Strongholds on the Syrian border

Al-Zarqawi, along with most of the rest of the Insurgent leadership, is on the run

The Iraqi Security Forces grow stronger ever day

The Iraqi Government grows stronger every day

Nations around the Middle East are now recognizing Iraq's new government

The Insugency has failed to destroy the US-led occupation

the Insurgency has made an enemy of the Iraqi people.

The general role of the US now (excluding Operation Matador) is to provide Armored and Air Support for the Iraqi Security Forces, who even now provide the large majority of the infantry for the fighting in Iraq.

The US already is beginning to have too many men in Iraq for the job.

To say we are stuckin in an Iraqi quagmire is to espouse the ludicrous.

I think your interpretation of my words is ludicrous. MARK

Silly questions to our Americans are there to stay crowd.



I assume you all do not live in the utopian communities that you would have us all think we should which in reality you do not actually live in either.

I also assume you have crime and criminals in this un-utopian city, county, parish, province, state and or country where you reside.

I also assume you all have law enforcement where in these locals that you live that may be as and or even more violent than Iraq over extended periods of measure.

It must be as well true that you have HIGH Crime and High Density Criminal areas, where your police concentrate their resources as these are the areas out of control, prone to violence and harm to the innocent.

You do the math, thereafter, therefore and wherefrom... Yada! Yada!


Has there been an American and or allied military presences in the Middle East in some form or and another since 1990. YES.

Will there be one as long as it is the wild West where renegades and raiders are, are harbored and or are developed, well Ya..

Until there are other political winds blowing that would surmise otherwise, which if the Democrats continue on the NO WRONG and my way is the only way courses they are on, may be sometime well beyond the next 3 years 8 months.

That is all!

David Schippers was the lawyer that the House hired to impeach Bill Clinton.

Months before 9/11 he was trying to get info to anyone in Washington about the pending attacks. Nobody would listen to him.

No republicans. He was their man just a short time before & they all ignored him when it was most important.

Do a web search under his name & hold on to your hats.

Should I assume your pleased weve now taken care of the problem by removing Saddam. MARK

Exactomondo!

That is all!

Removing Saddam created more problems than it solved, the US is creating terrorists faster than they can be killed.

Generals Offer Sober Outlook on Iraqi War:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/051905Y.shtml

Muslim World Largely Anti-American:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/051905C.shtml

Chalabi Back Pulling Strings in Iraq:
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/051805E.shtml

Catastrophe in Iraq:

http://snipurl.com/f0iv

http://snipurl.com/f0pq

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article8882.htm

I see old Juan Cole, what is he 60 or older by now, is still making money off you guys.

The guys good. He started in 1968 or shortly thereafter and has made a good living off this anti-establishment hustle. Got give to the guy his due. Most have moved on past the 60’s but not Juan and a few die hard types “the man is out to get you' hangovers still hustling the idealists lot. It’s a living I guess.

He does not discriminate. Over the years he has spun with the best of them in attacks equally negative about Democrats, and Republicans alike.

Always with the negative vibes, always on how F**ed up it is, the anti-establishment subject he has pick at hand at the moment. But with a twist, as in, without for the vast majority of rants, solution or when so seldom provide, with the most narcissistic of all solution to be conceived. I dare say ever in his what 36 year of suckering the suckers.

Good stuff though. Like leaves in the wind, Iraq, or should I say AS THE WORLD TURNS, as in soap opera of political gamesmanship being played outside and I guess inside that poor country.

I prefer to watch the whole game instead of assuming the score and outcome while it is still in play.

But what the hey, prognosticators, Preachers, Used Cars Salesmen and Politicians are all about making fiction fact and fact fiction are they not?

Da Juan is indeed metered as if a Preacher and used care salesmen with a politician propensity for soliciting money.

That is all!