A faction of the Thai military led by the army chief says it has overthrown Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

Soldiers have entered the prime minister's offices in Government House and tanks have surrounded the building.

Mr Thaksin, who is at the UN in New York, has declared a state of emergency and said he had removed the army chief.

A government spokesman insisted the coup "could not succeed", and told the Reuters news agency that the government was still in control.

The spokesman said it had not been decided when the prime minister would return home from the UN.

However, in a television broadcast the leadership of the armed forces said it had taken control of Bangkok, declared a nationwide martial law and ordered all troops to return to their bases.

The so-called "Council of Political Reform" they announced is apparently loyal to sacked military commander Lt Gen Sonthi Boonyaratglin and has declared its loyalty to the king.

However, the BBC's Kate McGeown in Bangkok says King Bhumibol is held in high esteem by all Thais, and the declaration of loyalty does not necessarily imply that he backs the takeover attempt.

An army-owned TV station is showing images of the royal family and songs linked in the past with military coups.

BBC World, CNN and other international news channels have been taken off the air, readers in Thailand told the BBC News website by email.

Our correspondent says low-level rumours of a possible coup have been circulating for weeks.

Political impasse

There has been pressure growing on the prime minister to resign, including from groups close to King Bhumibol, following a political impasse in which April's general election was declared invalid, says the BBC's correspondent Jonathan Head in Bangkok.

But it had been thought that Thailand was making progress towards holding another election later in the year, our correspondent says.

Witnesses said several hundred troops were posted at key points around Bangkok, including at government installations and major intersections.

Russell Miles emailed the BBC News website to say there were troops "dressed in Swat-style gear strolling around" near Government House, and "a tense, but fairly controlled atmosphere".

He said: "We saw a group of blokes bundling a cameraman and another chap into a van. We are taking photos, but not out in the open."

At the United Nations, where the annual General Assembly is under way, it was announced that the agenda had been changed to allow Mr Thaksin to address it in the coming hours.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/5361512.stm



Sad, really, though very common or not so out of character really. Historically since the constitutional monarchy was established in 1932, there have been 17 or 18 coups, as I recall, some very bloody, most not.

Saw it in 1973, or was it 72 and again in 1991, missed this one, as I sold out some 5 months ago all our business investments in Thailand taking all monies out except for our two homes.

More to a Rob kop survival instincts than anything else I suppose. Like feeling an ambush, yet not know why, it just felt “like Shiite was going to happen”. It appears I may have been, in the short run, correct, yet, hope and pray this one is not as bloody as 73!!

Anyhow, in Rob Kop, some time ago got all my family to get visas just in case, have a pre-planned exit plan for all. Would advice all, who have an human interest in Thailand, better to be prepared and wrong than caught up in something one is unprepared for and wrong.

Then again thinking in terms of survival and preemptive preparedness and survival has stood me well in regards to all conduct in my personal and business affairs these many years of investing in foriegn countries.

Good luck to all, God’s grace and fate to any all and in Thailand, if I can help should it get bad, I will endeavor to do whatever I can.


TUM DII DAI DII, TUM CHUA DAI CHUA!


T HA T
IS
A LL!

There are quite a few American expats in Thailand, tho many of them hate the United States so I find this as highly entertaining. I wonder if "those" who speak so hatefully of the US and Western civ in general will be crying for intervention, lol. For those folk I simply refer you to your non interventionist rantings. Hopefully the good folk from this board survive the socialist upheavels and the other anti American expats on here will now have time to rethink.

From what I understand Shinawatra was quite corrupt in using his position to enrich himself and family members.

Yes, Nomad, Shinawatra was very corrupt, enriching his family to the tune of BILLIONS of dollars, tax free. And, he twisted the lawful powers around so cleverly that his opposition became powerless to fight him legally.

ustrader, thanks for your good words. Last night was weird, with the coup going on, but my partner went to sleep early and has a very "mai bpen rai" (unworried, unresponsive) attitude. "It happened two times before, when I was younger; no problem," he said an hour ago.

Let's hope the military that did the bloodless coup does restore demoracy, soon and properly.

Indeed, mai bpen rai, is often than not a Thai response to just about anything until it is upon them. To many Thai’s this would be a most common and correct response for the most part.
Yet, I say, it is not over until is over.

Some noticeable perceptions;

1.) Do not underestimate that Thaskin, though, likely a cheat and dishonest though not likely less so than those to come over time, became unpopular over what was perceived as a sell out to a “foreign Government and cheating on his taxes in the process.

2.) The Opposition party is very anti-foreign and certain decrees effecting foreigners property rights and visa status have come abruptly on to the scene.

3.) Thaskin, cheat or thief as may be the case, did win by large margins in the last two elections he posted for, thusly showing a considerable number of Thai’s like him especially outside of Bangkok. This fact, in my rob Kop estimation, should not go under-estimated as to its potential down the road a ways.

4.) The Coup troops evidenced on the streets have distinguished themselves with banners and ribbons of the opposition PAD party, telling me that they are a group within the greater military and not necessarily representative of the entire Thai Military. Thusly, they may have Military opposition that is potentially out there.

5.) They have cut most major communications, suspended the Constitution and having surrounded his Majesty have announced on TV the King supports their coup 'd'etat. Strangely and oddly, the King has not come live on TV to prove that…

6.) The Pro Democracy rebellion of 1973, was a revolt against an established Military Dictatorship run by the gang of seven I believe. Similar, yet another was advance in the bloody right wing military efforts conducted in 1976. Finally, in 1991, through open, often disputed, Democratic elections, TRT took control of the Government. TRT is a populist party, particularly well entrenched outside Bangkok where two thirds of the population resides. An important fact to consider in the coming days and in ones precautionary preparations.

7.) I am not sure it is over until the fat lady sings, and thus far, what I have noted from my contacts within the Government and in ours there, the issue is far from decided just yet. There could still come some internal resistance not to mention opportunism by the Terrorist in the South. The foreign Embassies have issued be alert and aware and do not go near large groups email and notices.

8.) Though dismissed in this age of all governance is evil cynicism, it appears these coup leaders were until some their subordinates were caught, willing to kill many people in a Car bomb attempt on the PM. This is an act of desperation made in common deduction by people thinking they had no way to win an election.. A mindset that should not be dismissed as unimportant, for anyone willing to murder for otherwise unattainable power, would likely be willing to kill to maintain what they took by force, if resisted and or if turned away in the coming election if there is even one in the near future.


BE VERY AWARE AND PREVENTIVELY PREPARED EVEN IF MOST LIKELY UNNECESSARY I SAY AS THESE THINGS CAN SPIN QUICKLY OUT OF PERSPECTIVE.

It all says to me there is some chance for a resistance coming from inside and mainly outside Bangkok.

It also tells me, that once again, the more Thailand seems to have advanced and changed to be a democratic and stable modern society, the more it remains the same as it was some 60 years ago.

Using the gun if one happens to not like how the elections goes has always been the answer to disagreements in the vast number of nations of this world and in many places we all assume are advancing in rational and reason, yet are not really very far along that path we all would hope exists.

What is really sad, is the fact the next gang of governance, is not any less likely to be any more fair, any more honest and or less corrupt than the one these Tanks threw out…

I out, my money and assets are out and my family has moved to phase two of hopefully a uneccessary or needed exit plan...

Good luck to all there I am sure all will be fine but I say in all sincerity don't assume all is normal for it is not..

This is a power grab realted to funds from the psunami.

Violent Muslim Separatists support the coup and so does the King. And people actually take thailand seriously?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...6092001310.html

Gore Lost, you post as if you are insane, ignorant, or just plain.....blind.

The article you refer to, from the Washington Post, showed nothing I could see with one eye, about tsunami funds. It does not indicate that Muslims were part of the coup (well, of course General Sonthi..). Oh, and it's spelled tsunami, not ps.... Maybe you're confused about Nicaragua - de cierto - after Hurricane Mitch, that may be what you're thinking about (Arnuldo Aleman, now in prison), or Anastasio Somoza after the Christmas earthquake in Managua. They weren't Muslims, but they were Hispanics. And they were both bad, thieving Hispanics, but they didn't come to the USA illegally.

The coup in Thailand is not part of some evil Muslim terrorororororooisttt plot. Try reading for a change. Really, your posts are pitiful. Did you finish elementary school, or is your online persona just an alcoholic exercise by a frustrated junior professor of....pyrotechnics?

Indeed, spot on correct, an internal Thai affair far removed from any international discourse. Thought it is a slap in the face of a people's right to choose especially coming less than 1 month before the election was scheduled.

Thai's, in my estimation, as are most Buddhist, are very pragmatic about life, taking it as it comes, often as not as water toward the path of least resistance...

It appears it is going to be more a "mai pen rai" event with most Bangkok Thai's focused exclusively on how bad Mr T was and how good it is he is now overthrown instead of voted out.

As reported in the now heavily censured Bangkok Post (See below) A small poll of 2000 with about 1100 being from outside Bangkok, indicated the coup is popular to some 80%

Yet no one I have spoken with has seen the King live on TV yet confirming his support. Has any here seen the King live on TV supporting the coup?


Equally the atmosphere is as well mai pen rai, as to how likely bad the next guy and his group will be in the very image of Mr. T, if not worst.


NOTE TO THAI PEOPLE:-- Junta VIII

Next month's election has been suspended and maybe possibly, will be scheduled 1 year from this coming October in 2007.

The constitution is now suspended, martial law is enforce and all political parties are hereby disbanded and not allowed.

Public gathering of 5 people or more is hereby banned and any violators will be subject to immediate arrest and charges that could result in jail time up to 6 months in jail.

All forms of media were ordered by ICT to exercise censorship of any news critical of the coup-makers and the new military regime. Offenders face up to six months in jail, a fine of up to Bt10,000, or both. This also prohibit them to publish such content.

One step forward against corruption and for freedom is the popular mai pen rai consensus, as Boon me said.

Yet I ponder, in reality, if not 6 steps backwards toward rule by the gun and the even more corruption, where, one, if the history of coups are any indicator, often can get even worst than one had.


I have no dog in this fight per se Mr. T or any that will follow him other than any deadly affect they might have on my remaining family there.

For when, I first set foot on the soil of Thailand a military Junta ruled de-facto and in equal corruption of governance. Ever since not a day has past that corruption has not been equally the status quo. Only the faces and bank accounts and those holding the guns have changed in this regard ever since.

It was the norm then and now nearly a generation later, once again appears that the more it seems to have changed, in reality, the more it appears to have remained exactly as it was...

If all conforms to the normal patterns, we will see arrests, followed by convictions and some likely asset/property confiscation. Likely as well, the announced 1 year from October free elections, are likely to be extended for safety and good of the nation reasons.

Perhaps this time it will be different? Perhaps Democracy can prevail over the status quo, Perhaps...


P.S. (An opine)

However not likely or even necessary, emergency exits through normal border crossings are VERY problematic as to presences of military currently. Think out of the box if the likely unnecessary becomes a necessity.

Nobody will be crying for intervention or anything else.
Thai coups are largely bloodless and this was no exception. The worst "violence" was beautiful girls throwing roses at the soldiers and them taking pictures with Thai children and families.
Besides a few grinning Army guys wandering around in uniform, it's like it never happened.
Amazing Thailand indeed!

Nobody will be crying for intervention or anything else.
Thai coups are largely bloodless and this was no exception. The worst "violence" was beautiful girls throwing roses at the soldiers and them taking pictures with Thai children and families.
Besides a few grinning Army guys wandering around in uniform, it's like it never happened.
Amazing Thailand indeed!

ther prolly rising up cuz they h8 tailand's gov which wuz friend o bush.

The Thaksin regime was far from Democratic.. Wait until you see the numbers when they start adding up how much was scammed by Thaksin and his cronies. Incompetent thieving scumbags.

Indeed, yet, I ponder, but again, as a Camillian, reflective as much in colors of the past as in the colors of the future??

People actually don't take YOU seriously.

I support the coup and the King.
Thailand is not a democracy, it is still largely a monarchy.
Thaksin was very similar to Marcos and he is lucky to get out of this alive with most of his money, the blackguard!
The blame for the coup falls on Thaksin himself. He was given every opportunity to exit with dignity, but his pigheadedness prevailed.

More info on this fabolous coup:
http://www.nationmultimedia.com/specials/thefall/

Where is the cilivian PM as promise:
General Sonthi Boonyaratglin, who was yesterday appointed by royal command as head of the Administrative Reform Council (ARC), has promised to set up a civilian government within two weeks.

Full of lies, I don't think it a good sign for democracy in Thailand.

The United States expressed unease over reports Friday that a former army chief had been chosen to run Thailand's government after the military ouster of Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

News flash.
Nobody cares what the government of the United States thinks anymore.
Under bush, it has lost all credibility and respect.
The ousting of murderous, corrupt dictator is GREAT NEWS and should be celebrated. There was no way to do it democratically with the current system in Thailand. The US has no business preaching to other countries about democracy especially after the stolen election of 00.

Yet, when the shoe is on the other foot, there is no manner of polling, opine and insistence from those "other countries" whose business can not be minded by the US. Yet, who would mind incessently as if relevant and substantial in US business in all manner of ways without the slightest hesitation or equality of regard as our resident hyperbolic pontificates about ...

I ponder, is this the impartiality of an off limits egalitarianism as each would subscribe or yet more hyperbolical two-facedness showing the preachers do not practice their preachings of equal mindedness as to anothers business???

He who is to dumb as to argue the unchangeable and legally unproven is but doomed to once again argue in the success of failure, perhaps?

So you like the coup too?
What a load of gibberish dude!

The Truth is with the exception our family's safety there, which thusfar shows no measure of personal but perhaps some economic distress, I see no danger. I have no dog in this fight and as a FaR'ang, It is none of my business.

I sold out of All my Business interests and removed my money from there months ago in anticipation of my near on 30 years experience there as they say in the Thai word for deductive anticpation called "Rob Kop"...

Still have two homes there, one in Bangkok and one between Chaing Mai and Chaing Rai that some in the family live in. This will be our forth coup with only one bloody. I suspect all will go well IF the power does not corrupt the Junta as it has before... The next guy is as likely to be, after a short while, as corrupt as any before, yet I hope one day it will change from that pattern since 1932?

I don't see that things will change much in the near future.
I agree the corruption will continue.

Why?
Poor education.
Powerful monarchy that does not favor good education for the masses.
I think Princess Sirindhorn will be the next Queen, not the wastrel. She will continue the strong monarchy. I have come to the conclusion that the strong monarchy is the reason Thailand isn't Laos or Burma, but it is also the reason it is not Singapore or Japan. A mixed bag really.

The junta, with the King's approval, has appointed a highly respected and highly principled retired general, who fought Communism violently as a commanding officer when his own father was the leader of the Communist Party of Thailand. He thinks the military should stay out of politics as much as possible, and is coming out of semi-retirement (advisor to the throne) to do a one-year interim prime minister stint.

The fat lady hasn't sung yet, but General Sonthi promised to appoint an interim PM within "two weeks" and did it two days early. It looks good.

The USA has suspended or cancelled $24 million dollars in military aid only, a token amount, a drop in the bucket, per normal American policy. The Bush administration's knee jerk reaction to this military coup, while opposite to the junta that unsuccessfully overthrew the democratically elected Hugo Chavez, assumes that democracy is always so super-righteous that it's always wrong to overthrow it.

Here is some good info about the dastardly blackhearted tyrant the bush regime is sad is now crushed.
Takes one to know one, I suppose!

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2006/10/02...cs_30015147.php

Now tell the whole truth FITS, putting WHAT WAS LEFT OUT IN YOUR AGENDA that which was in the offical wording that included TEMPORAILY SUSPENDED and HOPEFULLY WILL BE RESTORED SOON AS THE SITUATION STABILIZES... Fastly different in meaning to what you said hey.

Why do find it necessary to be less than fully honest if all you think about the hand that feeds you and friends is so adulterated, dispsoiled and corrupted? Would not the mere truth be sufficent if your correct??










Perhaps you could do a "find" by clicking in your browser's "edit" then click find and then type the world BUSH and then United States, where you will find NO mention in this article of either that you supplant as remotely having anything to do with either BUSH or the United States.

If the United States is as messed up, corrupt, despoiled and lost as you and friends always say, why would you find it necessary to make up things about it, much less mention it in links that do not remotely use any reference to it...

QUOTE

Demosthenes:

Nothing is easier than self-deceit. For what each man wishes, that he also believes to be true.

Noam Chomsky:

It is the responsibility of intellectuals to speak the truth and expose lies.

My apologies, ustrader. The military aid from the USA to Thailand is temporarily suspended. Honest oversight; I keep trying to be brief but am very verbose instead.

You think I don't get it but I do...

Even if the military aid IS suspended indefinitely, the country will actually see much more money making it to it's coffers with the abscence of Thai Rak Thai and it's cronies. 24 million was probably pocketed by TRT politicians every week, so theyt must be ahead by now.

I ponder, having noted the same mindlessness posted on Thaivisa, has our resident, who has risen from the dead, been witness to a Thailand before there was a TRT party?

If so was he blind to how much pocketing politicians and government officials have been a major industry there since even before the first "Democracy" and of course the subsequent 17 now 18 military coups, for what turns out each time, but for anothers chance at the slop in the trough... I think he has not!

Give it 36 months or so, and only the faces and names will change and those like you will be saying the same thing about the coming them.

This Time, I hope I am wrong, but would not bet the farm on it for sure. Actually in that vien, I pulled out monetarially, except houses, months ago having seen this now 4 times.

Why bother...

It's been a long time since the coup, and the generals have made a lot of mistakes, without convicting the Thaksin inner cirlce of anything, and without decreasing the violence in the south. The baht is unbelievably, inexplicably, too strong against major currencies, which affects foreign trade. They've enacted even more stringent actions than the prior elected government did, against foreigners, tourists, foreign investment, ownership, etc. I'm not half as optimistic about Thailand as I used to be.

I fear you an't seen nothing yet, it has just begun, the Russian and Arabs are coming and all hell is about to break lose in yet more baa! klang reality...

They say that Pattaya is already full of Russians. You scare me, but you may well be correct. Almost anything is possible. I'm waiting for the exchange ratio to go back to 40:1.

As I said before about the Coup, it usual gets worst when the military takes power as a surge in economic and social nationalism seems clearly to follow as every time the military has taken power.

They, the Russians and Arabs, latter of which who are there in far greater numbers than ever before will soon be using muscle to take over the arms, forgery, drug and prositution business I suspect. I would expect more oddly reasoned explainations as to why like those two Russian women were killed.

As for the Bhat, my wild guess, with emphasis, is you will see 30 before 40 and or if it all goes to sh it with political chaos. Which is possible if the military loyalist are true to form making democracy and freedom promises but always finding reasons to never keep them, 60 perhaps...

Corruption is nothing new in Thailand. This is why it has remained to be the favorite escape point for many foreigner with money. You can buy whatever you want in Thailand.

Sonthi Boonyaratglin is a high ranking Muslim.

This coup found its civilian excuse in massive corruption. At the tips of this was all of the missing thai cash sent for Tsunami relief.

All in all this was a massive departure from democratic reform, period. You cannot support democracy and also support a coup, that makes no sense! There is still martial law in effect in 35 provinces of Thailand that still support Thaksin, it has not been a bloodless coup, and they continue to have violence.

Right now the military's Council for National Security shares power with the interim civilian government .

The cash that tipped the scales and sent Thaksin packing was not tsunami money; it was his sale of his telecommunications corp. to Singapore, a foreign country.

Sonti's religion is irrelevant. The man is a general who salutes the civilian and says, "Yes, sir" regardless of religion. He decided to listen to the civilians other than the Prime Minister.

Yes, Thailand is very corrupt (according to Transparency International, even more corrupt AFTER the coup!). Thaksin gave the corruption payoffs to himself and his new money cronies, instead of to the old money.

What do you mean, "this has not been a bloodless coup." Whose blood has been shed since October 18, 2006? Yes, you're right that it's not a democracy when there's a coup. The sham of democracy during Thaksin's last day was a travesty, and he deserved to be removed bloodlessly. Okay, so I'll admit I didn't scream bloody murder when the coup happened, but then I live here and saw no corpses caused by the overthrow of phony democracy. But Thaksin had thousands of Thais killed during the drug wars. Also, at the massacres down south, some of that is blood on Thaksin's hands.

The continuing violence is in the southern provinces that are mostly Muslims. The Thai Buddhists who control Thailand can't control those provinces, even with a Thai Muslim general in charge of the junta. Very sad, but true.

As for foreigners, we cannot even buy real estate here, legally. The Thai citizens can buy anything.

FITS, a few minor points, one, as populist, Good and kindhearted, as the Current King of Thailand is and has been, in his 60 year reign, the generals of Thailand have chosen Tanks and Guns Coupes as a means of political discourse 19 times since he came to power. That is 1 about every 3.5 years.

In fact, this King, some say for the unquestioned betterment of the Thai people, came to power, when his brother, the King, was assassinated, by Military people unrelated and or linked to the present King. It is alleged, they chose the gun as a political tool of discourse because his brother, the King that was murdered, was doing things the ruling elite and Generals were not happy with that effected their enterprises and interests.

Next, though seemingly out of sight consciousness in the drip, drip of but a column here and there, it is no small matter of deadly concern for anyone living in Thailand that some 2,540 people have died in the South, merely since January 2004. They have stayed south thus far, but with the links to Al Queada growing in but the simple fact that “Tourist” form the Middle East have increased dramatically.

You do remember the Pak who in merely being found out for his internet lies and thus rejects by a Thai women, he brutally dismembered her. There are more similar incidences as I am sure you are aware where members of Al Queda have been caught in Thailand and where information from them on Bomb making has been found in the South.

Ya can't Blame this one on the US nor the Demon God of Liberals, Bush. Then again, someone will try.

Lastly, you can “own” Real Property in Thailand. Outright you can own a Condominium and by other legal means such as Majority Thai owned companies involving x number of partners who actually have to put some verifiable money in game, and, as well, with 99 year leases, with estate options for renewal.

As is always in the third world, the bulls eye moves and swings on these always swing political pendulums. Though I have found in the countries were I have owned and built properties for personal and Business objectives, the lease has been the least vulnerable to institutional and political attacks when the shifting sands of legal interpretations shift over time.

That is all!!

Thousands of folk have died in this coup and are still dying in some regions in Thailand.

If relief money wasn't the "mantra" there it sure was paraded around here.

Ustraders point is correct in that it sheds light on the problems with a coup. It will ALWAYS be the method of political discourse once it is used.

Military intervention can only be a restorative force in the case of a civil war.

I'm not arguing with ustrader's points; I'm agreeing. Thanks, ustrader.