I watched the debate between Gingrich and Dodd, and they both made good points. I agreed more with Dodd, but Newt had his points too. Dodd says we have lost our moral authority over there, and on that I agree. Gingrich said if we leave, that the situation is going to get worse. That is probably true as well.
We are told that we can't leave until there is a stable government in Iraq. When will that be? They are no closer not to being stable than they were two years ago. To add insult to injury, the government is planning on taking a two month summer vacation while our troops continue to die there daily, trying to stablize their country. How's that for gratitude?
As of today, we have lost 3422 troops in Iraq, and that number will continue grow as the war rages on. No one but the troops and their families have personally felt the impact of this war. Sure, there are many who feel bad about the loss of life, but how many have been affected on a personal level? Taxes haven't been raised, there's been no draft, and no one is asked to conserve things like in wars past. We are financing this war on the future of generations to come, and it seems no one is worried or cares about that.
There are two sides to the argument of withdrawal timetables. Those opposed say it will inflame our enemies and send them the message that all they have to do is sit and wait it out. They will say that the enemy knows we don't have the wherewithal to stick it out to the end. The problem is, we don't have a clear cut knowledge of who the enemy is, and we don't even know what the end is. It's been changed so many times.
The anti withdrawal crowd also tell us that if we don't stay there until victory is achieved, they will follow us home. That is the one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. They are already here! Look at what happened last week in Fort Dix.Do you think they are the only ones? The pro war people point to the fact that we haven't been attacked since 9/11. They tout that as a justification for our war in Iraq and the larger war on terror. We haven't been attacked yet because those who wish to do us harm are patient. We didn't have any attacks from foreign enemies after the first WTC bombing for 8 years. If anything, the war has made us more likely to be attacked again.
The majority of Americans do support a timetable and want an end to this fiasco. I am in that group. We have been more than patient with the Iraqis, and sacrificed more than they have ever been willing to do. How much longer are we willing to give?
We can't leave until the Iraqi military is ready to take over their own security. Do you know how many Iraqi troops are actually ready? A mere 6000, that's how many! The other problem is that there are Iraqis who join up, only to turn on us and kill our troops. How can we tell who is really on our side? We just don't know. There have been stories about men in stolen uniforms who go and ambush the 'good guys'. I am not making this up. You can look this up yourself.
I know we cannot go back in time and undo what's been done. This war is is going to go down as one of the greatest failures in our history. I wish we had never gone, but it's too late for it. This war has damaged our credibilty around the world, and we have have lost our moral authority. We have acquired more enemies as a direct result of this war. Not only that, we have weakened our military. Even the generals say we would be in dire straights if we had a real crisis that would recquire a military solution. We simply don't have the manpower.
Some will deny it, but Iraq is engaged in a full-fledged civil war in which our troops are caught in the middle . How do we accomplish victory? We have people blowing themselves up daily by way of car bombs and suicide bombers. How do you win a war against those who aren't afraid to die? We can ill afford to take sides.
The hardest thing for me to swallow is I know we are stuck there indefinitely. We created this mess, and it is up to us to fix it. I just don't know how we are going to do that.
Another thing a lot of people don't want to think about is the loss of innocent Iraqi civilians. Some are killed by bombs, while others are kidnapped, tortured, and then dumped on the streets. Does anyone read the daily body count? It is staggering. I would wager that in hindsight, the majority of Iraqis wish this war was never started. Sure Saddam was a bad guy, but at least they didn't have to worry daily about being killed just going to the market for a quart of milk. I read a few months back that some of the Iraqis' biggest wish is to die of natural causes. How sad is that? I am deeply ashamed to know that the Iraqi suffering is a direct result of our presence there.
There is so much more I want to add, but I will stop here for now. Thanks for listening.
Full Version: MrLeft's rant about the war. (yes, another one)
What's happening in Iraq now between the Sunni, Shiia and Kurds has happened in Iraq LONG before the US was even THOUGHT about, let alone found by the white man.
The only reason for being in Iraq is to stay until we gain control over most of their oil. they don't want that to happen. France, and China are vying for it like they did when we had Iraq sanctioned.
It's the oil, guys. Keep track of the deals of the Iraq government pertaining to oil. Never take your eyes off that ball....
The only reason for being in Iraq is to stay until we gain control over most of their oil. they don't want that to happen. France, and China are vying for it like they did when we had Iraq sanctioned.
It's the oil, guys. Keep track of the deals of the Iraq government pertaining to oil. Never take your eyes off that ball....
DO YOU HEAR THAT!!!!
IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!
IRAQ! The silence from those once roaring Lions of the media and yelping whines from those lambs of loon, is deafening now.
Why is the question?
Perhaps, because we might actually be progressing to a positive end in Iraq, abet in inconvenient truth of fear and loathing from muted lions and inept lambs. What else explains that silence from media lions and muted whimpers of Loony lambs, now!
Now that is a silence which is an investment in failure. That true eschew; shunning: avoiding and stay away from deliberately in a indoctrinate U obfuscation of fearful bewilderment, confused in the mystified activity of obscuring elitist understanding, leaving them baffled or bewildered in their darkening obscures of weightless nothing, now so silent, in such heavy investment in America’s failure in Iraq and in the world.
Why do we have, from these Lions of selective media roars and muted impotent Lambs bellowing, in fear and loathing, this deafness of silence, so silently loud, now?
Where are you now o mighty deaf silence of roaring lions and muted lambs?
That is all!!
IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!-- IRAQ!
IRAQ! The silence from those once roaring Lions of the media and yelping whines from those lambs of loon, is deafening now.
Why is the question?
Perhaps, because we might actually be progressing to a positive end in Iraq, abet in inconvenient truth of fear and loathing from muted lions and inept lambs. What else explains that silence from media lions and muted whimpers of Loony lambs, now!
Now that is a silence which is an investment in failure. That true eschew; shunning: avoiding and stay away from deliberately in a indoctrinate U obfuscation of fearful bewilderment, confused in the mystified activity of obscuring elitist understanding, leaving them baffled or bewildered in their darkening obscures of weightless nothing, now so silent, in such heavy investment in America’s failure in Iraq and in the world.
Why do we have, from these Lions of selective media roars and muted impotent Lambs bellowing, in fear and loathing, this deafness of silence, so silently loud, now?
Where are you now o mighty deaf silence of roaring lions and muted lambs?
QUOTE
Hope is not a strategy until combined in spirit; with ones will, determination, and courage to action.
Likewise, despair is not a strategy, for it has already, in its spirit and essences, relinquished will, and determination, forsaking it all, for the cowardice of hopelessness. -TRADER
If human will and persistence is but the measure of right and wrong, good and evil and or peace and or peril, we in this emerging 21st Century paradigm of Schadenfreude Relativism, are all but lost to the unnoticed perils of our time, the blinded self indulgence of vested omnipotent narcissism. —TRADER
Likewise, despair is not a strategy, for it has already, in its spirit and essences, relinquished will, and determination, forsaking it all, for the cowardice of hopelessness. -TRADER
If human will and persistence is but the measure of right and wrong, good and evil and or peace and or peril, we in this emerging 21st Century paradigm of Schadenfreude Relativism, are all but lost to the unnoticed perils of our time, the blinded self indulgence of vested omnipotent narcissism. —TRADER
That is all!!
QUOTE
Hope is not a strategy until combined in spirit; with ones will, determination, and courage to action.
Likewise, despair is not a strategy, for it has already, in its spirit and essences, relinquished will, and determination, forsaking it all, for the cowardice of hopelessness. -TRADER
Likewise, despair is not a strategy, for it has already, in its spirit and essences, relinquished will, and determination, forsaking it all, for the cowardice of hopelessness. -TRADER
Great words Trader. Maybe the this is not above the heads of our leftist bookend friends. However I would not bank on that....................
Yes, the silence from the MSM on our Iraq successes is deafening but what else could be expected from those that secretly were cheering American losses and fervently hoping for an American defeat..............
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