I am disappointed at this sad display, especially in President Lee Bolinger of Columbia, and in CNN. What I saw today was us, as Americans who supposedly value the universal right of free-speech, making a mockery of that ideal. There was no reasoned argument. There was no graciousness whatsoever. I think the Columbia Hillel House was even more diplomatic. They had their signs, and they gathered outside - but they didn't insult anyone. They sat quietly and attentively while a man they revile spoke. I cannot say the same for Bollinger and CNN.

Flame me all you like.

First, I feel that President Lee Bolinger owes all of us, including Mahmoud Ahmadinejad an apology. I felt that his entry address was out of line, graceless, and without honor. His questions were legitimate; his insults were uncalled for. We all know what Iran is accused of, and we all know what the media and critics of Iran say about Ahmadinejad and the regime which he adminsitrates. On a personal level, if I was invited to speak at a prestigious university, and I was greeted like that - with unapologetic personal insults - I would walk off the stage while giving Prof. Bollinger two raised-up middle fingers. I'd dig through the public records and find every last bit of trash on Bollinger, and parade it around the world with a smile. I cut his face out and pin it to a dart-board. If this is how Bollinger interprets the hallowed ideal of free-speech after the debate we've had this week as a country, then I fear for us all. It is no way to welcome to a foreigner, no less a "distinguished speaker," no matter how much we disagree with him. This is an insult to Iran, and the free-speech in general. He has reduced our rhetoric about free-speech to a mockery. Secondly, CNN's Coverage was pitiful. While Ahmadinejad was rambling on about religion, he was cut off about 10 minutes into his speech. Some red-headed tart started arguing with a talking head about Iran's deeds, spouting the mainstream babble that we all know (you know, the babble that Bush will probably go to war for). Even if the speech was mundane, and probably quite canned - I still tuned in to CNN to listen to Ahmadinejad speak - not to hear this obnoxious woman continue to insult the Iranian President. He was given a platfrom to speak - yet I was prevented from hearing most of it. I wonder why this is? From all the coverage, not one person could engage the content of what Ahmadinejad was saying. No effort to understand his words... they just brushed them off, and continued insulting the Iranian President. You know - on any other day we can insult the man and criticize him. But not today - he is our guest. If we have a guest, and then insult him to his face and cite free-speech after doing so - then we've lost some measure of credibility in doing so. There is a time for criticism... there is a time for graciousness.

I'll now get to the point, and ask the questions I have based on this embarassing display: can we as Americans even handle free speech? Do we have the discipline to listen, even if we disagree with something? Or is free-speech merely a bit of rhetoric we can hang our hat on, and point to as we insult others for apparently not allowing such a right where they come from? Based on what I saw - we cannot handle that right, or we do not understand it - for it would seem we interpret that right as the liscense to be insulting, and to speak past our opponent, without displaying a shred of graciousness.

Have we, as Americans have lost our ability to be diplomats? To learn and to speak without hastily interjecting with an attack? Today's display is a prime example of that. And no less - the President of Columbia University is the key example. As an American, I am embarrassed for this.

The Iranian President, is really quite a sly fellow. He's a good actor. He's a good speaker. He handles pressure well. He's articulate. But in the end, I am unsatisfied with his address.

I am pleased with his words of respect and gratitude to the faculty and students of Columbia, and I am impressed that he did not stoop to Bollinger's level. Of course, I suspect he fed off that for an advantage in image. Like a master politician, he knew how to make a good personal impression. If we are to take Ahmadinejad's words at face value, there is much to like about him. But we know better.

I am disturbed that he offered virtually nothing new about Iran's nuclear program (which is shrouded in secrecy, and remains surrounded by much doubt as to its intentions), his stance on the holocaust (which remains ambiguous), and accusations that Iran is importing weapons that are used against American troops. There is much in his words which contradict my impression of him, largely because he was evasive. He denied every criticism with a smile. As upset as I am with Bollinger's address, Ahmadinejad did virtually nothing to dispel suspicion, or to deflect Bollinger's criticism.

Final thought: In the end, I think an exchange of students and scholars is a promising development, even if it may be too little, too late to change the collision course our government and theirs appear to be headed on. Building scholarly and cultural connections is an important development, and I hope those connections can be accelarated. I hope those connections will create mutual-respect between Americans and Iranians, and that it will illuminate the misdeeds and suspicious intentions of the Iran and American governments.

Then, consider yourself "flamed," especially since your comment about women and burkas, which deeply "disappointed" me in YOU!

If I could, I'd slap your face right now.

An inflamed woman.






I still think you're a fng fundamentalist Arab, posing as an American.

Does anybody have a direct URL to a reliable copy of the actual speech, please?

Perhaps unnoticed in American’s unawareness and unfamiliarity with the embedded zealotry of today’s Iranian Shiite religious beliefs, is President Ahmadinejad repeating of the same pray at the very beginning of every interview and every speech he made while here.

In repeating exactly the same prayer, he, in his snickering of enlightenment, knowing full well, even our supportive leftist elitists and our not so elite media, were so unaware and self absorbed in their own idioms and discourses, we would not remotely notice such a thing.

By repeating his “Mahdi prayer mongering,” he snickered in his hidden message to America and likewise in his additional hardly noticed messages of intent, announced to the world, at the UN, saying, in the code of the “Shia Twelver Madhdi about the “Zulfiqar,” “The nuclear debate over Iran is now closed.'

Encompassing in both messages a traditional Islamic warning to an enemy, sent but wholly ignored in the ignorance of their true meanings, is this Shia Iranian Twelver movement of a divine calling, for the “victorious return of the Mahdi, and, from that, the coming of that Theocratic Caliph, the promised new world order that will cleansed the world of the “disobeyers” which will result in a United Islamic World Nation.

It is within both of his “warnings” that is the message, so unnoticed, but which is proclaimed as the self assumed destiny of these Iranian Theocratic prophets. A warning of an unwavering focus on the politico-religious dimensions of a Shi'as believe that Muhammad al-Mahdi will reappear, when the world has fallen into chaos and civil war among all the human race, so that then, the Madhdi and his legends of the faithful obeyors can cleanses the world of the non-obeying unbelievers. By thus, creating a United World Islamic Nation which is the destiny of the Shias Twelver Prophets.

At its core is the Iraq were we infidels now stand, from which Shia prophecy dictates, the black flags of Karbala must arise and march to Mecca. Then and only then, can Muhammad al-Mahdi , the guided one, come wielding God's Sword, the Blade of Evil's Bane, the Zulfiqar (Arabic: ذو الفقار, ðū l-fiqār), or the mythical Double-Bladed Sword of God.

Guess what is to be this sword in theocratic mindsets of Tehran, one should ask, but few do?

Shi’as according to the Propehtics who now rule Iran must both control Iraq’s Karbala and have this mighty sword of Zulfigar, the bomb, in order to fulfill their self-assumed destiny as the current day leaders of this Twelver Shi'as movement.

A movement which assumes it is destine to cleanse the world of the unbelievers and bring all the world into the fold of a new Islamic Caliph (pronounced khaleef in Arabic) world order, in a united Global Islamic nation.

Of course we have this doomoracy of denial that does not grasp who will need to be cleansed, if at all. Thinking even if it true, only the ignorant and disobedient of their views and ideology of denial will be effected or there is nothing to fear, but Bush and well, really anyone else who disagrees with them.

Of course, they could be wrong and the cleansing mentioned as a needed act of prophecy, is, of course, us, them and the other nearly 4.7 billion non-Islamic believers in this world.

That is all!!

ummmmm...I LOVE red-headed tarts, they're my favorite kind of tart.....sorry, I digress...

I completely agree with your assesment. Why would you invite a man into your home and then insult him?

Look...if all you hear about is Mahmoud being evil...eventually, you'll believe it.

German's thought Hitler was a great man because that was all they heard about...

That's why I don't listen to anything CNN or FOX News says about anything anymore. If I want truth, I have to look really hard to find it.

Do I believe Mahmoud is evil? No more than I believe George Bush is evil. As far as I'm concerned, they're virtual clones of one another -- two big mouths that have taken some seriously unfortunate events and tragedies and thrust themselves to on the world stage while both failing miserably at home.

This might sound ridiculous...but what the world really needs is a world leader that pushes love and understanding instead of the mantra of MY PENIS IS BIGGER THAN YOURS!

ustrader, you're good at researching links. But I'm lazy, so I guess I'll just have to goooogle it.

Fits, Will you be as equally lazy at deduction as to what he said and implied as an intent in this regard.

He also included this Mahdi reference on the 60 Minutes and CNN interviews as well.

Columbia Speech.

SPEAKER: IRANIAN PRESIDENT MAHMOUD AHMADINEJAD
[*]

AHMADINEJAD (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): In the name of God, the compassionate, the merciful...

TRANSLATOR: The president is reciting verses from the holy Koran in Arabic.

AHMADINEJAD (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): Oh, God, hasten the arrival of Imam al-Mahdi and grant him good health and victory and make us his followers and those to attest to his rightfulness.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...7092401042.html

UN Speech;

Dear Friends and Colleagues,

"From the beginning of time, humanity has longed for the day when justice, peace, equality and compassion envelop the world. All of us can contribute to the establishment of such a world. When that day comes, the ultimate promise of all Divine religions will be fulfilled with the emergence of a perfect human being who is heir to all prophets and pious men. He will lead the world to justice and absolute peace.

"O mighty Lord, I pray to you to hasten the emergence of your last repository, the promised one, that perfect and pure human being, the one that will fill this world with justice and peace.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/library/...0918-irna02.htm

Now look up;

Muhammad al-Mahdi

Shia Twelver Movement

God's Sword, the Blade of Evil's Bane, Zulfiqar (Arabic: ذو الفقار, ðū l-fiqār), the Double-Bladed Sword.


Page 2;





Failure;



a culture with ONE VOICE of mediocrity,
espousing the mediocre as the ultimate antipathy and denial that sadly real world events of blatant Social Darwinism’s do exist and are happening in this ONE VOICE UTOPIAN WORLD OF DREAMERS.



For the Lost Cannonade;

the Alert-Net News sorcerer, who, in the finest traditions of Uber-laissez-faire mongering, informs us he is oddly on a first name basis with this demented Napoleonic Complex driven Iranian.

Thus, I conjecture it is true, that, birds of a feather do Foot-drag in ONE VOICE visions, together.

Like his good friend examples in their joint illusion that in this alter-reality that is today’s information age, this Iranian ghoul and the liberal’s efficacious Evil Demon, Bush, can remotely be capable of keeping people as uniformed as was possible in Hitler’s age. Then again, it seems some here seek to be misinformed in the inconvenient truths of their sorcery of the 5th columnist kind.

Perhaps he would NOT like to read this article on the issue of his good friend and partner;

Sarko Steps Up

The French President's Un-Chirac foreign policy.

http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/fe...ml?id=110010535

Morass Spewing Negative Bellowing Communalists

That is all!!

Thanks for the one URL that I requested, ustrader. Thanks anyway for all the others. The man's speech to the UN two years ago does take its toll on my ADD; so many platitudes. My degree in religion was not earned in Islamic studies. And I don't care to do the rest of the research into whether Islksdios is connected to skdiee by sldkfasoeiru through the amalgamation of synthesis of eeeeiiii and lllxlxlxlx. When I'm asked to navigate my way through several translations from Iranian and Arabic into English, it may as well be written in gibberish. It's my fault for not wanting to figure it out.

Thanks, anyway.

I've read almost all of Ahmadinejad's speech at Columbia and the discussion with him publicly, after the speech. He never denied the Holocaust in that speech, nor did he swear to wipe Israel off the map.

First off, I must ask, as it seems illogical and incongruent that you could obtain a “Degree in Religion,” and it not encompass an educational context of the teachings of other religions like Islam and Buddhism?

Perhaps you made a Freudian slip here, or perhaps your degree was in Christianity, a religion far from encompassing the larger context, of religion?

Your lack of interest in the truth about the "Iranian Mahdi monger" here is truly Pathetic FITS.



In 3 minutes, of even multitasking, I found this vast array of mainstream media evidence that you would not take a millisecond to seek out in an effort of validation of the facts.

Instead, in the usual preference of this doomocracy, you rely on the mirages of inconvenient truths as if factually meritorious.

Here is a relevant collection of quotes from Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad.

“There is no doubt that the new wave (of attacks) in Palestine will wipe off this stigma (Israel) from the face of the Islamic world, ... The World without Zionism. Anybody who recognises Israel will burn in the fire of the Islamic nations' fury [and] is acknowledging the surrender and defeat of the Islamic world.” (source)

http://news.scotsman.com/topics.cfm?tid=13&id=2150862005

"Israel must be wiped off the map" (source)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml.../27/wiran27.xml

"America was free to sever its ties with Iran, but it remains Iran's decision to re-establish relations with America." (source)

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/GF21Ak04.html

"Our enemies can deal a blow to us any time they wish. They do not wait for permission to do this. They do not deal a blow with prior notice. They did not take action because they can't." (source)

http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?ed...rticle_id=16353

"The wave of the Islamic revolution will soon reach the entire world." (source)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9352275/from/RL.3/

“Iran is ready to transfer nuclear know-how to the Islamic countries due to their need.” (source)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9352275/from/RL.3/

Here is a quote from the Canadian Islamic Congress this week:

"The Canadian Islamic Congress is congratulating Iran on having produced low-level enriched nuclear fuel this week, calling the achievement "an important step forward" in improving the country's long term economic well-being." (CIC release)

http://www.canadianislamiccongress.com/mc/...ique.php?id=753

August 28, 2007

"Zionists are people without any religion. They are lying about being Jewish because religion means brotherhood, friendship and respecting other divine religions…
They are an organized minority who have infiltrated the world. They are not even a 10,000-strong organization."

(At a news conference in Tehran)


August 18, 2007

"The Zionist regime is the flag bearer of violation and occupation and this regime is the flag of Satan. …It is not unlikely that this regime be on the path to dissolution and deterioration when the philosophy behind its creation and survival is invalid."

(Address to an international religious conference in Tehran)

June 3, 2007

"With God's help, the countdown button for the destruction of the Zionist regime has been pushed by the hands of the children of Lebanon and Palestine . . . By God's will, we will witness the destruction of this regime in the near future."

(Speech, as quoted by the Fars News Agency)

March 21, 2007

"It is quite clear that a bunch of Zionist racists are the problem the modern world is facing today. They have access to global power and media centers and seek to use this access to keep the world in a state of hardship, poverty and grudge and strengthen their rule. The great nation of Iran is opposed to this inhuman trend. Of course, the Iranian nation will stick to its rightful stance. The Zionists and their supporters do not know that they are using failed approaches to take on human values, human civilization, nations and the great nation of Iran. Admitting the right of the dear Iranian nation and submitting to justice and the rule of law are the best way to salvation and the best way out of the deadlocks they have created for themselves."

(from a recorded New Year's message aired on Iranian television)

February 28, 2007

"The Zionists are the true manifestation of Satan . . . Many Western governments that claim to be pioneers of democracy and standard bearers of human rights close their eyes over crimes committed by the Zionists and by remaining silent support the Zionists due to their hedonistic and materialistic tendencies."

(to a meeting of Sudanese Islamic scholars in Khartoum)

December 12, 2006

"Thanks to people's wishes and God's will the trend for the existence of the Zionist regime is downwards and this is what God has promised and what all nations want…Just as the Soviet Union was wiped out and today does not exist, so will the Zionist regime soon be wiped out"

(Comments to Iran's Holocaust Conference)

November 29, 2006

"What have the Zionists done for the American people that the US administration considers itself obliged to blindly support these infamous aggressors? Is it not because they have imposed themselves on a substantial portion of the banking, financial, cultural and media sectors?"
(Letter from Ahmadinejad "to the American people")

November 13, 2006

"Israel is destined for destruction and will soon disappear"
Israel is "a contradiction to nature, we foresee its rapid disappearance and destruction."

October 19, 2006

"The Zionist regime is counterfeit and illegitimate and cannot survive"
(as quoted by Iranian state television)

August 6, 2006

"They (Israel) kill women and children, young and old. And, behind closed doors, they make plans for the advancement of their evil goals."
(as quoted by Khorasan Provincial TV)

To find more go here;

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/4616336.stm

That is All!

That's what my transcript says, ustrader. Religon. You're right, that it's in Christianity, and here in Thailand, that's what I say, a major in the Christian religion.

The subect of his thread (not that such a thing matters in Bedlam, of course) is the man's speech at Columbia Univ. this month. Thanks for the link.

Here is my take on this thread.

First, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad should be real frightened about coming over here to start with. Did not the President say something about harboring terrorists?

QUOTE ("President Bush")

Second, we have made it clear to all nations, if you harbor terrorists, you are just as guilty as the terrorists; you're an enemy of the United States, and you will be held to account. (Applause.) And third, we've launched a bold new agenda to defeat the ideology of the enemy by supporting the forces of freedom in the Middle East and beyond.

Secondly, has it not been proven that Iran has supplied the enemy with weapons? And didn't our US military complain about the following?

QUOTE

The U.S. military on Sunday accused Iran of smuggling surface-to-air missiles and other advanced weapons into Iraq for use against American troops.

Not to even mention the fact that Iran is aiding and harboring terrorists in Afghanistan as well!

QUOTE

For the second time this month, Iran has come under scrutiny after Afghan security forces recovered a shipment of weapons destined for Taliban insurgents that came from across the border...

..."We do not have problems with Turkmenistan -- all the trouble comes through Iran," the deputy chief of border police for western Afghanistan, Samowal Hamidullah, told AFP in the western city of Herat.

Now seeing all of the evidence that is written all over Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's face, why is it that our they-can-run-but-they-can-not-hide- Bush administration even permits this man to be in his own country perpetuating these heinous acts of harboring terrorists?

Now to address MrLeft's remarks.

QUOTE

First, I feel that President Lee Bolinger owes all of us, including Mahmoud Ahmadinejad an apology. I felt that his entry address was out of line, graceless, and without honor. His questions were legitimate; his insults were uncalled for.

Why does Mr. Bollinger owe anyone at all an apology? Doesn't he also have the RIGHT to express himself the way that he wishes to do so?

In my opinion, using the mental framework of the Bush administration of course, President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad should be doing just what Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein had to do--start running.

Take special note that he is not. Why?!

Grizz, not surprised you didn't know this.
It's a UN Security Council meeting. The president of the host nation does not "invite" anyone nor does he have any say in who can come or who can't.

As far as evidence of Iran supplying weapons to the insurgents in Iraq (BOTH sides by the way), there's a LOT more evidence than you apear to think there is. Or do you not believe your own military?

Does the UN Security Council determine the safety of the troops and the citizens of the USA, Ken? Like I said: What's Bush doing about this?




Hello. Earth to Ken. Try reading my entire posts in the future, OK?

I already believe that Iran is helping out the insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan. I do so hope you enjoyed your little trip to the moon and back, though.